NOT MAKING CHLORINE, LONG STORY, NEED ADVICE

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Last Post 06 July 2021

Steveinmypool123 posted this 26 June 2021

I live30 miles South of Charlotte NC. Opened the pool April 15; Contracted with a pool chemistry company to remove my pool stains. 15,000 to 15,500 gallons. Pool stains appeared to be from metal, ( not conclusive ), pool stains almost dissapeared , then they gradually reappeared.

I can live with the pool stains, they are not the reason for this post. Since following all instructions from the pool stain removal company I am experiencing choline problems or bettert yet no chorline problems. I have a Hayward T-Cell 9 in my system, it is three years old , it gets cleaned twice a year and was cleaned two days ago. My pool filters were replaced last week, my water is crystal clear, most pool water readings are within spec or very cclose to spec, from to different pool compaines in my local area. Problem is I am producing no Chlorine, system computer says everything is fine...... not so..... all testing of water says no chlorins being produced...... Diagonistics says ,,,,, 24.2 volts at 4.75 amps...... Im assuming the T-CELL is working ...... however I am not producing Chlorine...What am I missing....????? if Im drawing current across the cell how am I not producing Chorline... Salt leve is 3600....Need help

Thankyou

SteveG

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JCMC70 posted this 27 June 2021

Hi Steve,

You may be missing the possibility that the salt generator is working properly but there are organics in the water that are consuming the chlorine as fast as it is being generated.

There was a lady who posted this same issue a few days ago. You can read that thread HERE.

The water may be clear but it can still have organics growing in it.

The only way to tell is with a complete set of chemical readings. Free Chlorine, Total Chlorine (or combined chlorine), PH, Total Alkalinity, Calcium Hardness and CYA(stabilizer).

I know you said the water readings were within or close to spec from2 different pool companies but here's the thing, pool company readings are notoriously untrustworthy.

Get yourself a good test kit that will test for high chlorine levels and all of the other tests above. These are FAS/DPD test kits.

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Steveinmypool123 posted this 27 June 2021

Thank you for the reply. It makes good sense, as I'm comfortable that the generator is working, However I have it tested tomorrow when the pool store opens.

Again thanks for the info

SteveG

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JCMC70 posted this 27 June 2021

Do you mean you will have the water tested?

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Steveinmypool123 posted this 27 June 2021

No, im going to put the Chlorine Generator on a Hayward test stand.

Here are the readings from last Tuesday

FC........0.13ppm

TC........0.42ppm

COMB C.....0.29ppm

PH...... 8.2

HARDNESS.....219ppm

ALKAL...... 97ppm

CYAN...... 5ppm

PHOS..... 314ppb

SALT..... 2992

PH down to 7.7 this morning

Also starting to acquire green / yellow alge on pool ways..

SteveG

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JCMC70 posted this 27 June 2021

Also starting to acquire green / yellow alge on pool ways..

There's the organics. You're getting an algae bloom. You're going to need to SLAM the pool water. That's a method of shocking the pool that will kill the algae efficiently and effectively.

BUT, Your immediate problem is the CYA reading of 5 ppm. There isn't enough stabilizer in the water to keep the sunlight from burning up the chlorine. Salt generators need 60-80 ppm of stabilizer (CYA). But for the SLAM process all you need is 30 - 40 ppm because the salt generator should be turned off during the process.
Once everything is killed and the water is clear you can turn the salt generator back on and raise the CYA level to the recommended amount.

CYA can be added to the pool in 2 different ways, dry stabilizer and liquid stabilizer.
If you use dry stabilizer you will need 4 pounds to raise the CYA level to approx. 35 ppm. The drawback here is the amount of time it takes to add dry stabilizer to the pool.

If you use liquid stabilizer you will need 168 ounces, or 1 gallon and 5 cups to bring the CYA level to approx. 35 ppm. With the liquid stabilizer you simply mix the stabilizer in a 5 gal bucket filled 2/3 full of water, then slowly pour the water/stabilizer mix in front of a return. The downside to liquid stabilizer is it's more expensive than dry stabilizer.
Dry stabilizer needs to be fully dissolved in water, which usually means adding no more than a few ounces of stabilizer to a 5 gal bucket full of water and thoroughly dissolving it before adding to the pool.

An easier way to add it is to add al 4 lbs. to a sock, or cut the foot off of a pantyhose and put it all in there, then tie the sock/hose to a pole/plastic pipe and suspend it in front of a return. Either way of using this method will take days.

No matter which one you use, backwash the filter before starting because the filter must run continuously and can't be backwashed during the process of adding stabilizer and for 48 hours afterward.

While you are raising the stabilizer level you are going to need to super chlorinate the pool water.

The chlorine level to SLAM a pool with 35 ppm of stabilizer is 14 ppm. And this level of chlorination needs to be maintained until the algae is completely killed.

You are gonna need a test kit that will show high chlorine levels to do this. The 2 most recommended kits are the Taylor K-2006 and the TF-100 FAS/DPD test kits.

Let me know if you're interested in this process.

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Steveinmypool123 posted this 27 June 2021

As you seem to know what you are talking about how do you suggest I procede. Which should be done first, Slam the pool to kill the algae then correct the CYA or vice versa or can I do both at the same time.

SteveG

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Pensruleice posted this 27 June 2021

Hi Steve!

I thought I was the only one in the country with this problem! (I still have this issue by the way) Let me know what worked for you and i will do the same.

I have a 50k inground, vinyl liner, (2) 1 1/5 hp pumps on ec65 hayward de filters. I just this year switched over to (2) circupool rj65 SWG's from 3" pucks). Same problem as you! The pool is sparkling clean (I can see a needle at the bottom of the 10') Chems are good enough (I have had this pool since 1986) I can not get chlorine! I put the (2) off line chlorinators back on and still no chlorine! I shocked it 3 times! The next day the chlorine is gone!. I am ready to drain the salt out and go back to 3" pucks, as I have NEVER had this problem before!. The SWG company said it was phosphates and that the generators are "sensitive" (I was sorry i had hurt their feelings!). At this time I am waiting for a phosphate test kit. I have NO algae (didn't have it when I opened either). CYA is good (I can't wait for fall to close this money pit!) Let me know what worked for you. I will update when I get my phosphate test kit.

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JCMC70 posted this 27 June 2021

You need to adjust the CYA level first. If you don't get the cya level up, you will never be able to keep enough chlorine in the pool to kill the algae. But at the same time you need to keep as much chlorine in the water as you can. Do you have any shock on hand now? If so, what is it?

I would recommend using liquid stabilizer because of the time issue.

Take a fresh water sample to the pool store when you are picking up the stabilizer. If the new tests still show a PH reading of 7.7 that will need to come down before starting the slam process. Pick up a bottle of Muriatic acid for that. And see if the pool store carries liquid chlorine. Liquid chlorine is the best way to do the slam.

Pool chlorine comes in two strengths, 10% and 8%. You will need enough to bring the chlorine back to the slam level at least 3-4 times.

In a 15,500 gal pool with a cya level of 35, the slam chlorine level is 14 ppm.

You would need 272 ounces (or 2 gallons and 2 cups) of 10% chlorine to get 14 ppm in the water.

8% strength would require 320 ounces or 2 gallons and 8 cups

If y can't find liquid chlorine let me know what kind of shock you can get.

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Steveinmypool123 posted this 01 July 2021

Pool is now fine, CYA is back up to 55ppm, (4lbs powder), pool has been shocked, ( 3 bags pool shock), Chlorine Generator producing as it should be now that the pool has CYA in it. Think the whole issue was the CYA picked up and left, and I don’t know why. I think a good guess would be the chemicals I put in the pool to remove the stains….. just a guess.

Bottom line thanks to your guidance and the pool store concurrence I’m back up and running, and Grand kids are swimming right now.

Thank you very much for you time and effort leading me down the correct path

SteveG

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Steveinmypool123 posted this 01 July 2021

Pensruleice

Please see my last post today to J at 1M

My problem was caused by a couple of things, most notable was the loss of almost all CYA (stabilizer) in the pool also contributing was a high phosphate level and no chlorine. I’m pretty sure now the almost nonexistent chlorine was caused by the extremely low CYA, and I did get an algae bloom due to the imbalance of chemicals.

With all chemicals now in balance the pool is once again working fine

SteveG

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JCMC70 posted this 01 July 2021

Hi Steve,

I'm glad the SWG is working again. But your CYA level is still low. The ideal range for a SWG is 60 to 80 ppm.

Think the whole issue was the CYA picked up and left, and I don’t know why. I think a good guess would the chemicals I put in the pool to remove the stains….. just a guess.

There are only two ways to reduce CYA in pool water, drain water and replace it with non stabilized water or an expensive reverse osmosis treatment. I don't know of any pool chemicals that affect CYA levels. Even Evaporation doesn't cause CYA levels to be lost.

I don't know your procedure for closing your pool, but if you're like me you drain water below the skimmer when you close the pool. The next season you replace that water. That water doesn't have stabilizer in it, so unless you get a new CYA reading and replace the CYA that was lost, the CYA level drops.

Bottom line thanks to your guidance and the pool store concurrence I’m back up and running

I get that people think the local pool stores know what they are talking about, and they should. But consider this, if the people at the pool store knew what they were doing why didn't they tell you that the CYA level was low when they saw the 5 ppm level ?

Just sayin'

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Steveinmypool123 posted this 01 July 2021

I close my pool the way you close yours, could be I just missed the CYA getting low and wasnt paying any attention... and then put a lot of town water back in the pool and it just went down hill from that point. I also remember ithat i have not put and CYA in the pool for 4 years. as everything was fine. Guess im the dumb ass.

Secondly the pool company I use is very knowledgable, I was following there recommendation and backing them up with another source of information, as I have been missled by a Pool Chain befor ,the pool company I now use is a family owned company that has been around for many years, however Im a firm believer two identical opions are better than one.

I will bump my CYA up a couple of notches..

Thanks

SteveG